Requisite post-Doctor Who emotive reaction entry

[zolac_no_miko]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

So.

• Before Moffat started on his run of Doctor Who, was anyone expecting his Who to be gayer than RTD's? I wasn't. I AM PLEASANTLY SURPRISED.

• SO YES RIVER SONG well holy shit this explains a lot of things about her doesn't it?

• THE ONLY WATER IN THE FOREST IS THE RIIIIIIVEEEEERRRRRR~!!

• I'm told that there were many many Amy/River slashers. HAHAHA AWKWARD~! XDDDD

• HOW LONG HAS MOFFAT BEEN PLANNING THIS?

• So it looks like River probably will be killing the Doctor after all, yeah? I thought perhaps the guy she killed was not going to be the Doctor because IT'S JUST SO OBVIOUS I thought it had to be a red herring, but... well, yeah, it's really looking like River now. ...HEY evilhippo WELL DONE, you got that part sort of correct a little bit! XDDDDD

• ROOOOOOOORRRRRYYYYYYYYY omg if I thought I could get away with it without being brutally murdered by your wife THE NAUGHTY NAUGHTY THINGS I WOULD DO TO YOU. UNF.

In other news I was watching Who with Mom last night (we've started season five! :D) and it occurred to me that the Doctor Who theme and the X-Files theme could be mixed together quite nicely. Just think about it: BA-DA-BA-BUMP BA-DA-BA-BUMP BA-DA-BA-BUMP BA-DA-BA-BUMP, do-do-do-do-do-dooooo~!

Comments

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

Seems like we're totally unanimous on the spin-off, from what I'm seeing. MOFFAT, ARE YOU PAYING ATTENTION?

That's a good point, could be Rory... OH GOD I HOPE IT'S NOT RORY, FOR SERIOUS MOFFAT HOW MANY TIMES DO WE NEED TO KILL THIS MAN? You're right about Stormcage, I believe our mystery murder is supposed to be why she's there. It's really hard to project what's happened/happening/is going to happen, because we lack a lot of information about the timeline. We don't get to see the Astronaut's face in the lake, she could be older than a little girl there. By that token, though, the Astronaut could be someone else entirely. Although I do think River acts remarkably suspiciously during that whole event... from what I can remember. I'll have to watch it again.

RORY IS BADASS AND FANTASTIC, TRUFAX. I'm sorry I voted against Arthur Darvill. ;_;

[b-c-draygon.livejournal.com]

If he isn't, HE SHOULD BE!

I hope it's not Rory, I don't want him to die. Again. D: (I counted how many times he's died/nearly died/sort-of-died. SIX TIMES. In a total of five episodes. Not consecutively, but still. And he was treated to three deaths in three consecutive episodes of this series. Not that I'm obsessed or anything. *shifty eyes*)

Oh, good. I'm really glad that's not a piece of fanon that I've accidentally headcanon-ed. XD That's always a danger. That's true: she could be significantly older the second time we see the suit. River does act kind of strangely - but would she really shoot at herself (and risk creating a paradox in which she kills her past self)? ... AUGH, my brain hurts now. Definitely will have to re-watch this series from the start, so I can try to work it out.

Also: I am still somewhat convinced that the Silence are still up to something, somewhere ... That might just be paranoia, though.

It's OK, honestly! Don't beat yourself up about it. :) Just so long as you acknowledge how AWESOME Rory is, it's all good.

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

Well, see, it's the shooting that I find most suspicious. Haven't we seen how spectacular her gunslinging skills are? And yet, she empties her entire clip at this Astronaut and misses. I think she was putting on a show for Amy and Rory's benefit.

But it's totally possible it's someone else. For one thing, as apple_pathways pointed out, she would be crossing her own timeline. ...Then again, the Doctor's done this many times, and Rose did it and... yeah, it's totally possible for River to be there twice, since she doesn't really interact with herself.

The Silence had better still be up to something. They spent all of season five dropping hints about them and they are defeated in the second episode? Yeah I don't think so. Also, didn't it get said at some point in those opening episodes that they're all over the universe, not just Earth? I am betting we will see them again this season, and if we don't I will be very disappointed in the writing.

[b-c-draygon.livejournal.com]

Actually, yeah. Very good point. (Though she had just seen the man she loves die; maybe that put her off. Longshot, but a possibility?) Hmm, this definitely bears thinking about. And re-watching.

But, if River got that particular message with that date and time, she would know exactly what she was going to witness - and she at least appears as shocked as Amy and Rory when the Doctor dies. She's also very calm at the picnic, which I imagine she wouldn't be if she knew what was coming. (Then again, so is the Doctor - and presumably he knows. Given what Amy inadvertently told him.)

I have no idea. I'm just typing words as I think them up ...

Just noticed that you've been discussing the Lake below. GOOD POINT: What is up with the lake? Why is the astronaut in there to begin with, and why does it return to the lake afterwards?! That had better be explained. Because it makes very little sense.

Heh, no, I think Moffat's better than that. The Silence are supposed to be responsible for several worlds (mentioned last series) going down the toilet, so they're definitely not just an Earth thing. It's entirely possible they'll be back, probable even. I think Moffat is just trying to mess with us: make us think they're gone and that everything's OK, just to lull us into a false sense of security. (That's what happened to me last series. I thought the Silence was just an effect of the Cracks. Turns out, not so much ...) I think if the Silence don't come back at some point, I'll be writing an very disappointed letter ...

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

Oh yeah, future!Doctor totally knows he's going to die, he's very sad and subdued and goes on about not running anymore.

[apple-pathways.livejournal.com]

So, is it absolutely the implication that River is the little girl in the spacesuit, or do we believe it's still open to interpretation?

I think there's still more to come, and am not entirely convinced that the girl who regenerates = River. (However, I don't think it's incompatible with what we've seen so far. If it turns out to be the case that River/Melody/the Pondling turns out to be the little girl the spacesuit, I wouldn't be too surprised.)

However, I'm almost completely convinced that the astronaut who kills the Doctor is Someone Else. (If it is River: why does she come out of the lake? Heck, even if it isn't River: why does the astronaut come out of the lake??? AND: if it's River, there's some 'splaining to be done about why she can cross her own timeline in that scene and nowhere else.)

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

Well, I thought they'd pretty well covered that the little girl is Amy's daughter back in the second episode, and we've now established that River is Amy's daughter... and how many little girls with Time Lord additions to their DNA do we think are running around the universe anyway?

Red herrings are always possible, so I am prepared at all times to be surprised, but I can't imagine them pulling some alternate explanation on us in any way that would be at all graceful.

SERIOUSLY WHY THE LAKE. I HOPE THERE IS A GOOD EXPLANATION FOR THIS. ...That's a good point about the timeline-crossing. Although it wouldn't be the first time Who has cheerfully contradicted itself for the sake of convenience.

[apple-pathways.livejournal.com]

I thought they'd pretty well covered that the little girl is Amy's daughter back in the second episode,

When did they do that? I must have missed something.

how many little girls with Time Lord additions to their DNA do we think are running around the universe anyway?

There's at least one more...remember Jenny from The Doctor's Daughter? (I like to call her GIANT DANGLING PLOT THREAD, or 'Ginny' for short. :P)

Although it wouldn't be the first time Who has cheerfully contradicted itself for the sake of convenience.

Which is always the monkey wrench thrown into every bit of solid fan speculation! "Surprise! We changed the rules again!" :P

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

Rewatch from like, 17:45ish. She sees eyepatch lady for the first time in a door, and when she opens the door and goes in the room there are all of these pictures of Astronaut girl and a picture of Amy holding her baby.

Yes, well, the Astronaut girl is definitely not Jenny. And she's, like, full Time Lord, isn't she? ...Like I said, I think it would be sloppy plot at this point to have another secret!human-girl-with-a-wee-bit-of-Time-Lord running around.

Yeah, as I pointed out to b_c_draygon, people cross their own timelines all the time, actually. The Doctor does it soooo many times, Rose does it... it's hardly a sticking point. And, if Astronaut girl is River, they've been in the same place together already.

[apple-pathways.livejournal.com]

I am still gathering my thoughts about the pictures in that room. On the one hand: that's a classic tv/film reveal. "Hey, this used to be that little girl's room! Look, there's pictures of her all over! Oh, she's Amy's daughter: there's a picture of Amy holding a baby right next to the other pictures of the little girl!" So, if we're going by what classic tv storytelling dictates, then yeah: the implication is pretty clear that that's Amy's baby.

BUT: I don't know, I feel like I've come to expect more from Doctor Who/Moffat's storytelling. Because those pictures only work as evidence as long as you think within the bounds of a tv storytelling device. But the more I think about it: why would a little girl have a dresser full of pictures of herself and no one else? The one picture that does contain someone else (the picture of Amy with the baby) conveniently obscures the identity of the child: that could be any baby in the picture. (This show has definitely made me paranoid and turned into a weird Who conspiracy theorist.)

So, I see what you mean: it's definitely implied that the little girl in the spacesuit is Amy's daughter. But, anyway: that's why I think there might be some wiggle room for it to turn out to be someone else.

No, it's definitely not Jenny: you're right, she definitely wouldn't register as 'human'. I was just using her as an example of another little girl possibly running around the universe with the ability to regenerate. ;)

The Doctor, as we've learned, can pretty much do whatever the hell he wants. (He's a Time Lord! It's something about the third, time-sensitive DNA strand...) And if I remember correctly, when Rose crossed her timeline those big dragon creatures showed up to eat everyone. So: I dunno. It's hard to tell when they're bending the rules, and when they're actually breaking them.

And, if Astronaut girl is River, they've been in the same place together already.

This is one of the reasons I don't think it's her. (Because I am stubborn, and become very cross when the show doesn't follow all the silly rules that it has set up for itself!)

[evilhippo.livejournal.com]

Those pictures are just the ones that come with the frame! At some point in the future Amy and her baby are gloriously reunited and someone snaps a picture and as it passes through time some sod in marketing somewhere gets a hold of it and goes "Oh, this is a happy moment, it will make people buy this frame!" Plot point solved! (What I'm really trying to say is this is the kind of thing that happens when Moffat gets it into his head to make everything all twisty.)

The more I think about it, the more zolac_no_miko seems right on the crossing timestreams thing (timestreams, timerivers, timeponds?). The Doctor and Rose were fine crossing their own timelines until Rose touched her past self. So, non-interference with your past self is key (though minor interference in past events is okay. So I guess River involved in saving her babyself would've been not okay, but if she were to be involved in the kidnapping (which happens anyway), it might be okay? I dunno...) It seems like it makes sense for River not to cross her own timestream (and Rory does point out that last time the Doctor did it, the universe blew up), but she's also markedly absent (I think) from all the scenes with the girl, other than the mysterious lakestronaut scene... how involved in the events around your past do you need to be before it counts as interfering? (Because what's the point of time travel if you can't be in two places at the same time?) I think I'm just rambling here now, so I should probably stop.

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

No, River was also there when Astronaut girl got shot, too. And actually, that's the only definitive time they were in the same place... we don't know for sure yet that the Lakestronaut is the Astronaut girl. But I think it very well could be.

[evilhippo.livejournal.com]

What I was thinking wasn't so much as "there" as in "in the same general place" but there as in "we can see them both at the same time." She and Rory were in the Silence's ship when the girl showed up, and goodness knows what they could've gotten up to, time and space wise, before everything went runaway-crazy.

Tangentially to Lakestronaut, I keep thinking about how they do underwater training for astronauts to simulate weightlessness, and I can't help but feel like that might be part of the explanation for why the astronaut was down there. But that also makes no sense, so I don't know why I keep thinking about it.

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

Ah, you're right, now that I go back and watch more carefully I see they don't actually meet. ...Well, then, good! No timeline interference there. ^_^

Hahaha, Moffat's got us grasping at straws. I JUST HOPE THIS WILL ALL MAKE SENSE AT SOME POINT.

[evilhippo.livejournal.com]

IF IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE, THESE STRAWS HAD BETTER AT LEAST MAKE THINGS EXTRA-FIZZY.

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

Hahaha, clearly I could be wrong, either of us could, but I think you're probably just being paranoid and over thinking. I think the pictures are what they seem to be. I mean, why would there be a random picture of Amy and her baby in with a collection of pictures of some other random kid? And honestly, regarding only having pictures of herself... this is a little girl who's being raised to be a weapon... how many friends do you think she has? And speaking of being raised to be a weapon... nevermind how many human girls with Time Lord attributes we think are running around... how many human girls with Time Lord attributes who are living weapons do we think are running around?

Yes, but with Rose, it was fine until she directly interfered... nothing happened when she and the Doctor were just standing there. And then when she was hanging out with her baby self, that was fine until she touched her baby self.

[evilhippo.livejournal.com]

Tangent again! Speaking of being raised to be a weapon... how come human girls who are destined to be weapons always get named River? I feel like at this point, parents are just asking for it (though Amy didn't technically do it on purpose. But if anyone names their kid River from now on? They totally have it coming). (Either that, or Moffat is a secret Whedon fan and this is a very, very roundabout geeky nod.)

[zolac-no-miko.livejournal.com]

Hahahahahahaha omg I didn't even think of that! XD

The question now is... do I or do I not name my daughter River...? Would the badassery be worth the emotional trauma?

Your icons keep being so extremely appropriate....

[evilhippo.livejournal.com]

It's a tough call. I feel like by using that name you're either setting yourself up for a kidnapping, or you're already the kind of evil genius that would raise her daughter to be a weapon. I'm trying to circumvent this by adopting... That way I'm not technically at fault, and I get to be a cool-side character. Probably some kind of misled but good-hearted part of the machine that's making her what she is, and eventually I'll cry and wave my kerchief as she goes off to be a hero with the people she was meant to be killing. Or I'll get killed spectacularly and that's how she'll discover her humanity. Either way. I make adopting children sound like adopting a murderous cat from a sci-fi novel. Clearly it's not anywhere near time for me to take in any children.

I'm actually surprised I've had so many appropriate icons for this conversation. It must be destiny.

[ssw-loved.livejournal.com]

Randomly replying here, but what if the girl in the suit isn't the regenerating girl? Does river even have enough time lord DNA to regenerate? Or. .. is Or possible the girl could be river And the doctors daughter?

My smart phone is auyocorrecting shit.